<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Down the Nendrai Hole [19 Thory 4385]</title>
	<atom:link href="http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/</link>
	<description>A World Tree Chronicle of Transaffection, Adventure, and Doom</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 18:30:30 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Veritas</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13116</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 04:06:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13116</guid>
		<description>I certainly don&#039;t want to push you toward encountering more nendrai for a larger sample - those two, heck, Vae alone is doom aplenty!

But there are people who derive pleasure, or at least excitement, from some degree of pain. Seems like it&#039;d be that much more likely among the nendrai, who can shrug off such massive amounts of pain as it is.

(It&#039;s curious that Draught of the Rassimel Mother was painful; it was described as being, I think, one of three safe ways, versus over a hundred total, to accomplish that task. But it&#039;s a less drastic change than many gentler Mutoc spells - it&#039;s convincing the body to do something it is equipped to do, just at a time that it normally isn&#039;t ready for it. Though I could understand it being at the least a surprising sensation, and of course a non-Rassimel-female wouldn&#039;t personally know what it really felt like... Ah well. This is the analyst in me coming out to play.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I certainly don&#8217;t want to push you toward encountering more nendrai for a larger sample &#8211; those two, heck, Vae alone is doom aplenty!</p>
<p>But there are people who derive pleasure, or at least excitement, from some degree of pain. Seems like it&#8217;d be that much more likely among the nendrai, who can shrug off such massive amounts of pain as it is.</p>
<p>(It&#8217;s curious that Draught of the Rassimel Mother was painful; it was described as being, I think, one of three safe ways, versus over a hundred total, to accomplish that task. But it&#8217;s a less drastic change than many gentler Mutoc spells &#8211; it&#8217;s convincing the body to do something it is equipped to do, just at a time that it normally isn&#8217;t ready for it. Though I could understand it being at the least a surprising sensation, and of course a non-Rassimel-female wouldn&#8217;t personally know what it really felt like&#8230; Ah well. This is the analyst in me coming out to play.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Veritas</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13115</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 12 Mar 2010 01:39:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13115</guid>
		<description>I just meant that if Mutoc effects were inherently painful, people would probably prefer to use Ruloc effects, and thus would be more likely to study RuCo than MuCo, for those things which are same-complexity. Where complexity differs(Change Places is less complex than Control Places despite identical net effect), all bets are off.

Though, come to think of it, Orren would be a more obvious exception, since they can boost the power of any wanted MuCo effects applied to them.

Tangentially: It strikes me as interesting that most people who have an inherent affinity to Mutoc(i.e. Sleeth) also have a significantly more potent affinity for the specific combination of Ruloc and Corpador. There are, of course, some other people who are favoured by Gnarn... but by and large, it seems that Orren, rather than Sleeth, would be most likely to use MuCo in place of RuCo, all else equal.

All else rarely is, so that&#039;s probably not a very meaningful statement. I guess this is what academia does to a mind!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just meant that if Mutoc effects were inherently painful, people would probably prefer to use Ruloc effects, and thus would be more likely to study RuCo than MuCo, for those things which are same-complexity. Where complexity differs(Change Places is less complex than Control Places despite identical net effect), all bets are off.</p>
<p>Though, come to think of it, Orren would be a more obvious exception, since they can boost the power of any wanted MuCo effects applied to them.</p>
<p>Tangentially: It strikes me as interesting that most people who have an inherent affinity to Mutoc(i.e. Sleeth) also have a significantly more potent affinity for the specific combination of Ruloc and Corpador. There are, of course, some other people who are favoured by Gnarn&#8230; but by and large, it seems that Orren, rather than Sleeth, would be most likely to use MuCo in place of RuCo, all else equal.</p>
<p>All else rarely is, so that&#8217;s probably not a very meaningful statement. I guess this is what academia does to a mind!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: sythyry</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13114</link>
		<dc:creator>sythyry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:14:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13114</guid>
		<description>One might prefer a painful MuCo spell to a painless RuCo one if one were much better at Mutoc than Ruloc, and if the results of the spell were crucial.  E.g., a painful teleport spell (if there were such a thing) might save one&#039;s life. 

I wouldn&#039;t describe Ready Adulterer as painful exactly.  It feels more &#039;tight&#039; to me.  I don&#039;t use it very often though; perhaps it feels different to someone who is actually fertile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One might prefer a painful MuCo spell to a painless RuCo one if one were much better at Mutoc than Ruloc, and if the results of the spell were crucial.  E.g., a painful teleport spell (if there were such a thing) might save one&#8217;s life. </p>
<p>I wouldn&#8217;t describe Ready Adulterer as painful exactly.  It feels more &#8216;tight&#8217; to me.  I don&#8217;t use it very often though; perhaps it feels different to someone who is actually fertile.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: sythyry</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13113</link>
		<dc:creator>sythyry</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 20:11:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13113</guid>
		<description>Mutoc is not inherently painful as a whole.  Certain matters are inherently painful if done via Mutoc rather than the right way -- healing in particular.  Certain others are inherently painful for other reasons: if you make my bones spiky, it will hurt, because having spiky bones hurts. 

Nendrai don&#039;t actually enjoy pain. Well, don&#039;t enjoy *their own* pain; Vae can be quite sleethy at times.  They do not mind it as much as the rest of us, and they do seem to understand that constantly training their vitality is crucial for their survival.   

At least, this is true of the ones I know best, Vae and Oixe.  Other individuals may differ.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mutoc is not inherently painful as a whole.  Certain matters are inherently painful if done via Mutoc rather than the right way &#8212; healing in particular.  Certain others are inherently painful for other reasons: if you make my bones spiky, it will hurt, because having spiky bones hurts. </p>
<p>Nendrai don&#8217;t actually enjoy pain. Well, don&#8217;t enjoy *their own* pain; Vae can be quite sleethy at times.  They do not mind it as much as the rest of us, and they do seem to understand that constantly training their vitality is crucial for their survival.   </p>
<p>At least, this is true of the ones I know best, Vae and Oixe.  Other individuals may differ.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Veritas</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13112</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 19:02:57 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13112</guid>
		<description>This makes somewhat more sense than other rationales. A Mutoc spell that&#039;s well-tuned should be able to be just as gentle as Cloak of Another God, if not quite as much so as innate, physical shapechanging(as an Orren&#039;s to water-form is). Nendrai, on the other hand, actively hurt each other(and even themselves) as a measure of minor but steady vitality practice. I don&#039;t know if it&#039;s because they enjoy pain as such(though some might, certainly), so much as that they have an incredible pain tolerance and even that incidental abuse of the body that a brute-force Mutoc spell gives is jarring enough to the spirit to give a little bit of a nudge to vitality.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This makes somewhat more sense than other rationales. A Mutoc spell that&#8217;s well-tuned should be able to be just as gentle as Cloak of Another God, if not quite as much so as innate, physical shapechanging(as an Orren&#8217;s to water-form is). Nendrai, on the other hand, actively hurt each other(and even themselves) as a measure of minor but steady vitality practice. I don&#8217;t know if it&#8217;s because they enjoy pain as such(though some might, certainly), so much as that they have an incredible pain tolerance and even that incidental abuse of the body that a brute-force Mutoc spell gives is jarring enough to the spirit to give a little bit of a nudge to vitality.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Veritas</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13111</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 18:56:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13111</guid>
		<description>The order I refer to is as things came up in Sythyry&#039;s journal.

There has never been any mention of Cloak of Another God being painful - quite the opposite, it was contrasted to the nendrai&#039;s shapechange spells as being quite gentle(feeling rather like changing clothes). The only time zir journal mentioned Mutoc as being painful was starting around the time zie met Vae. I don&#039;t recall a single such mention prior to the first time Vae healed herself with Mutoc.

And this doesn&#039;t answer the question: why use the MuCo spell when a RuCo will do the same thing, if the MuCo is painful? They&#039;re identical in complexity.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The order I refer to is as things came up in Sythyry&#8217;s journal.</p>
<p>There has never been any mention of Cloak of Another God being painful &#8211; quite the opposite, it was contrasted to the nendrai&#8217;s shapechange spells as being quite gentle(feeling rather like changing clothes). The only time zir journal mentioned Mutoc as being painful was starting around the time zie met Vae. I don&#8217;t recall a single such mention prior to the first time Vae healed herself with Mutoc.</p>
<p>And this doesn&#8217;t answer the question: why use the MuCo spell when a RuCo will do the same thing, if the MuCo is painful? They&#8217;re identical in complexity.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Sinuuf</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13110</link>
		<dc:creator>Sinuuf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:27:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13110</guid>
		<description>Ready Adulterer is in fact rather painful for a moment. The changes are minor, as is the pain, and they are completed almost immediately, as is the pain. Your order is in fact, not in the least bit correct; Mutoc has a reputation for pain because of it&#039;s association with Gnarn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ready Adulterer is in fact rather painful for a moment. The changes are minor, as is the pain, and they are completed almost immediately, as is the pain. Your order is in fact, not in the least bit correct; Mutoc has a reputation for pain because of it&#8217;s association with Gnarn.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: terrycloth</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13106</link>
		<dc:creator>terrycloth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 23:37:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13106</guid>
		<description>It might be that nendrai-based mutoc tends to hurt, since they don&#039;t care about hurting themselves much and actively enjoy hurting other people.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It might be that nendrai-based mutoc tends to hurt, since they don&#8217;t care about hurting themselves much and actively enjoy hurting other people.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: xolo</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13102</link>
		<dc:creator>xolo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 16:20:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13102</guid>
		<description>Presumably he&#039;d still have nostrils, even though his muzzle had turned to wood.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Presumably he&#8217;d still have nostrils, even though his muzzle had turned to wood.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Veritas</title>
		<link>http://sythyry.com/2010/03/09/down-the-nendrai-hole-19-thory-4385/comment-page-1/#comment-13101</link>
		<dc:creator>Veritas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 14:00:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://sythyry.com/?p=1178#comment-13101</guid>
		<description>Yes, this. There&#039;s been some inconsistency in how Mutoc is treated. Cloak of Another God, obviously, is Mutoc Corpador, and isn&#039;t described as in any way painful; there are many other useful MuCo spells that would be much less appealing if they were painful (especially e.g. Ready Adulterer, which has a RuCo analogue of the same complexity).

It could be, of course, that those spells are specifically designed to be gentle... but on the face, it seems rather puzzling that MuCo has acquired a reputation for pain since it came to light that Mutoc-based healing hurt.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, this. There&#8217;s been some inconsistency in how Mutoc is treated. Cloak of Another God, obviously, is Mutoc Corpador, and isn&#8217;t described as in any way painful; there are many other useful MuCo spells that would be much less appealing if they were painful (especially e.g. Ready Adulterer, which has a RuCo analogue of the same complexity).</p>
<p>It could be, of course, that those spells are specifically designed to be gentle&#8230; but on the face, it seems rather puzzling that MuCo has acquired a reputation for pain since it came to light that Mutoc-based healing hurt.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
